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Nya`

Even more problems surrounding Watch Dogs

27 posts in this topic

Well it appears that once again Nvidia has dug their anti-consumer financial claws into a company and product with proprietary features and code which intentionally dampen performance on AMD hardware due to no on site involvement or optimization. This comes as no surprise to me with Ubisoft's shoddy track record, as a whole the entire game seems to be extremely poorly optimized and due to Ubisoft working exclusively with Nvidia and black balling AMD the performance on Nvidia video cards 40%+ less powerful perform the same as or in excess of AMD's flagship R9 290X.

 

A card which mind you from a performance standpoint is better than both the GTX 780 and GTX Titan and essentially on level with the GTX 780 Ti. Like the article says people are going to point the finger at AMD for this like they always do, and like always it has absolutely nothing to do with them... I am so sick of these anti-consumer oriented companies, it's disgusting and they're ruining PC gaming...

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2014/05/26/why-watch-dogs-is-bad-news-for-amd-users-and-potentially-the-entire-pc-gaming-ecosystem/?partner=yahootix

 

If you're curious just how much more powerful the 290X is in general compared to the GTX 770 this will give you a strong indication of the gap between them.

 

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/1059?vs=1037

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But is it Nvidia or is it actually the developer who makes these deals? Never quite understood that part. And it's been the other way around as well. Don't forget Rage.

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But is it Nvidia or is it actually the developer who makes these deals? Never quite understood that part. And it's been the other way around as well. Don't forget Rage.

I'm sure Nvidia comes at them flashing a ton of cash and they shallowly accept it, it drives up Nvidia sales so that is the only way it would really make sense.

 

What about Rage are you talking about? I want to make sure we're on the same page.

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I remember I had texture pop-in issues with my ATI cards in RAGE and had to be a Nvidia influenced issue, no?

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I remember I had texture pop-in issues with my ATI cards in RAGE and had to be a Nvidia influenced issue, no?

That was an issue involving id, Nvidia was unrelated to that. They didn't properly optimize the code for the AMD drivers that were available so AMD had to do damage control for what the developer had done or in this case not done and code an optimized driver specifically for the game to fix what id overlooked. It was something really lazy on their end and AMD paid the price for it because of the spread of misinformation.

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I remember I had texture pop-in issues with my ATI cards in RAGE and had to be a Nvidia influenced issue, no?

That was an issue involving id, Nvidia was unrelated to that. They didn't properly optimize the code for the AMD drivers that were available so AMD had to do damage control for what the developer had done or in this case not done and code an optimized driver specifically for the game to fix what id overlooked. It was something really lazy on their end and AMD paid the price for it because of the spread of misinformation.

As far as I remember it, the fuss was all about the game not running well on Nvidia cards, but running just fine on AMD cards.

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As far as I remember it, the fuss was all about the game not running well on Nvidia cards, but running just fine on AMD cards.

It didn't really run well in general to be honest, but AMD had a severe texture pop in problem because the game code was essentially not coded to function on the existing drivers at the time.

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Ok so basically Nvidia  paid Ubisoft alot of money to make their cards better optimized for Watch Dogs. AMD does the same thing but they dont seem to do it as often or with games that people actually care about. Feel free to correct me if im wrong.

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Ok so basically Nvidia  paid Ubisoft alot of money to make their cards better optimized for Watch Dogs. AMD does the same thing but they dont seem to do it as often or with games that people actually care about. Feel free to correct me if im wrong.

AMD has an open source approach to everything they do, they don't segregate themselves or their technology, they want everyone to be able to use it and enjoy it including Nvidia users. When it comes to AMD branded games those are simply games that they partnered with from the ground up, that doesn't mean Nvidia optimizations will be any less substantial, it just means that AMD had involvement in the code so it would run great on the hardware they provide.

 

They don't lock Nvidia out of this process, they can be right there with them, Nvidia on the other hand though will lock out AMD at all costs not only with technology but with partnering if at all possible. They are a selfish company only concerned with money and furthering their brand, they don't care about consumer interests for the future and they have a competitive stance which negatively affects the entire industry.

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AMD does not like Nvidia and Nvidia doesnt like AMD. Yes right now AMD is open source crazy and thats great but Nvidia is the exact opposite. There are pros and cons to each of these different approaches but AMD is going to need to get with the program and stop giving Nvidia all there amazing technology when they should be keeping it for themselves and optimizing for their own cards. If that makes sense.

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AMD does not like Nvidia and Nvidia doesnt like AMD. Yes right now AMD is open source crazy and thats great but Nvidia is the exact opposite. There are pros and cons to each of these different approaches but AMD is going to need to get with the program and stop giving Nvidia all there amazing technology when they should be keeping it for themselves and optimizing for their own cards. If that makes sense.

That just hurts the industry for the consumer, you create separation, it turns what should be a single unified platform into one which offers different things much like owning an Xbox One vs. that of a PlayStation 4. Things in the PC space need to be uniformed, they need to be in harmony working together because the fact is it is a single platform, it's not multiple.

 

I can't think of a single pro to the way that Nvidia conducts business other than the fact it generates them more money as a corporation. I don't see how anyone aside from an investor could see that as something positive, it's anti-consumer policy and regressive. Nvidia should be making their technology available for everyone, not throwing money at companies to hurt people who happen to buy from a different vendor.

 

Just as there is no pro for the way Nvidia conducts business as far as the consumer is concerned there is nothing negative about the way AMD conducts business. They develop technology and want it to be used and experienced by everyone rather than stunting platform advancement and ensuring different experiences by locking people out, there is absolutely nothing negative about that.

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Nvidia doing what it does allows them to make devices or programs centered around their own graphics card that all interact. Where as AMD is trying to make themselves more open for everyone and thats great but its not doing them any good. They need to optimize it for their own cards first then if they want make it open to Nvidia. There both pro consumer there just doing it in different ways. 

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WHAT an ubisoft game with bad optimization IT CANT BE!? oh wait thats only every other game they've ever made on pc as well lawl.

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Nvidia doing what it does allows them to make devices or programs centered around their own graphics card that all interact. Where as AMD is trying to make themselves more open for everyone and thats great but its not doing them any good. They need to optimize it for their own cards first then if they want make it open to Nvidia. There both pro consumer there just doing it in different ways. 

This guy in the comments section of the article has an excellent grasp on this and I am just going to leave it at that, you don't seem to understand what is and is not pro-consumer behavior and policy.

 

 

This is what I was pointing to with how Nvidia behaves quite a while back, it isn’t interested in competing, that’s why it scooped up PhysX, that’s why it won’t license any technology it owns, and this specifically has been looming in the rafters for a long while. I get that people love Nvidia, they create splendid graphics cards(barring the FX series launch which, pardon me, launched ATI into that 40% gain over ten years ago), they have innovative platforms which energize with those cards, but they are increasingly taking a Microsoft/Apple approach to competition, which is to say, kill them.

 

Suffocate the life out of them at all costs, this wasn’t their way initially, but ever since PhysX I’ve seen an increase in this stratagem, as AMD opens more and more doors, Nvidia races to close them. There’s guarding your competitive advantage, and then there’s monopolization, and if I recall correctly Intel had no real competition with the Pentium D, and Nvidia had no real competition with the Geforce FX launch, so we know how badly things are for us when competition is so fettered.

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That was actually what i was just typing well ok. I can see both sides.

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I read this and knew once AMD had won the bidding wars on all three consoles, Nvidia would be pushing hard on the PC front in any way they can. If that means providing unique features but potentially harming the developer, publisher, or the main focus AMD then so be it.

 

Only way for consumers to adjust a company's stance is by not buying into their products. Spreading fact not anger or hate, but allowing the community to see the truth for what it is. However they choose to see it. 

 

Healthy competition is good, breeds new ideas but I would say AMD has felt laxed in marketing their products to PC gamers.

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As far as I remember it, the fuss was all about the game not running well on Nvidia cards, but running just fine on AMD cards.

I watched TB's vid on Rage the other week, pretty sure the issue was with ATI.

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Healthy competition is good, breeds new ideas but I would say AMD has felt laxed in marketing their products to PC gamers.

From an enthusiast PC users perspective, If you need to be marketed to for the products you use you're not a PC gamer, you're a casual puppet being told what to buy. Nothing against Nvidia as far as a hardware company but they soak up all of the newbie hand needing to be held gamers on the PC, they cater to a casual market.

 

Sure AMD could do the same thing and baby these people but there is a certain point where you have to cut the cord and let people figure things out on their own, I think where they sit is just fine.

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As far as I remember it, the fuss was all about the game not running well on Nvidia cards, but running just fine on AMD cards.

Here! At around the 5 minute mark he states "right now AMD cards have MASSIVE problems with this game"

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I did not know that AMD was open source; I can really respect that. I'd be worried about them as a company with these sort of deals but then AMD secured all three next gen consoles. I think they'll live to fight another day. That's not to say that what Nvidia or Ubisoft (not sure who the blame lies with entirely) did with Watchdogs isn't deplorable. I'll definitely keep that in mind when I'm upgrading my rig next and as a result the Nvidia Shield does look a lot less appealing now. Competition is vital and if Nvidia is really going the Apple/Microsoft route I think that's a bad sign. It makes sense why the new Nvidia cards are always exorbitant until the AMD cards show up and bring all the prices back down to Earth. 

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Here! At around the 5 minute mark he states "right now AMD cards have MASSIVE problems with this game"

Then I just remembered it incorrectly.

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This kind of thing is as old as the GPU themselves, are people even surprised anymore? To be honest the difference is usually minimal and pretty overblown, Watch Dogs seems to have far bigger problems in that it's poorly optmized no matter what you're using.

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Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait......

Are you intimating that the PS4 edition may actually be better than the PC version if you don't have an Nvidia card?

Seriously as this will affect what I pick it up on.

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Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait......

Are you intimating that the PS4 edition may actually be better than the PC version if you don't have an Nvidia card?

Seriously as this will affect what I pick it up on.

I can't even play the game on my PC right now, it crashes during the intro, I would have rather bought it on my Xbox.

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Whatever bug is making you not able to play, very probably has nothing to do with those benchmarks.
 

 

Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait......

Are you intimating that the PS4 edition may actually be better than the PC version if you don't have an Nvidia card?

Seriously as this will affect what I pick it up on.

 


Even if I was using ATI I'd still go with the PC version, AC 4 had some optmization issues and bugs at release as well(mostly patched.) and the benchmarks he linked aren't that bad. Watchdogs is just badly optmized all around though, Total Biscuit said his computer couldn't hold it at steady 60 on ultra high, dropping to 40 and he has two Titans.

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