• Welcome to the Angry Joe Show Army!

    Join our community of gamers passionate about our community and our hobby! Whether it's playing, discussing, or watching games, regardless of platform, genre, or location, we have a place for you, always!

  • PS4 Forum

    The AJSA Playstation 4 Division: Game Nights and More!

    The AJSA is on Playstation 4! Join us for weekly Game Nights with a selection of the best games the PS4 has to offer!

  • XBO Forum

    The AJSA Xbox One Division: We Got You Covered!

    The AJSA Xbox One Division is ready to connect with you on XBox Live with a ton of events for the best Xbox games!

  • News Archive

    The Best News from the Best Sites, Every Week.

    The AJSA News Collection Team is hard at work condensing a week's worth of news into one giant-sze digest for you to chew on and discuss! Links to source articles are always provided!

  • More Info

    The AJSA Expeditionary Force: Deploying to Play the Best PC Games!

    The elite vanguard of the AJSA, the Expeditionary Force (EF) chooses a new PC game every week! Join us for weekly events and help decide if the game has a future in the AJSA.

  • The Team

    Streaming Now: The AJSA Stream Team

    Joe can't stream every game, but our talented AJSA Stream Team covers a wide variety of games and personalities! Check them out, and show them some AJSA Love!

  • The Tube

    The AJSA Community YouTube Channel

    Featuring news, gameplay clips, and more from the community! The Community is a chance to showcase the best moments in AJSA Gaming!

Seviteal

Bloodborne being exclusive was a mistake, and 'Souls' fans suffer for it.

22 posts in this topic

With E3 being soon, Rumor are has it that Dark Souls 3 might be announced. With this reveal many would expect a 'Souls' game to be mulyiplatform as all the other ones were. And yet here lies the problem: Bloodborne.

Bloodborne is the most recent 'Souls' game, (don't pretend like it isn't) and yet it is also available to only a third of it's potential player base. If there were to be a multiplatform Dark Souls 3,it would be essentially competing with...itself aka Bloodborne. I know they're different games but they're both 'Souls' games and both made by the same company, and you can be sure Sony has an interest in keeping 'Souls' games exclusive, which brings up this dilemma. A fractured player base and competiting games that are both technically part of the same franchise.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah... it kinda shot itself in the foot here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not our fault Sony Japan was also developing it, not to mention Sony has a iron grip on the IP.

I will not pretend Bloodborne is not a "Souls" game, since the game was intended to be a spiritual successor to the "Souls" games.

 

Not to mention that you also forgot about Demon's Souls, which still to this day, is only available on the PS3.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

If there were to be a multiplatform Dark Souls 3,it would be essentially competing with...itself aka Bloodborne

Maybe if Dark Souls 3 and a new Bloodborne were releasing around the same time but the existence of the other won't do much to effect sales.

DemonsColt likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry about the technical errors in the original post, I had little time to compose it. I didn't know that Demon's Souls was an exclusive, and this shows to me that Sony and From Software are not shy about working hand in hand, which makes the future of the Souls series even more worrisome considering two of the four 'Souls-like' games by From Software are PlayStation Exclusive.

 

But I am not concerned with the past 'Souls-like' games except in which they can help us predict what might be expected from Dark Souls 3. Like I said before, Sony has every interest in keeping 'The From Software Game' exclusive to it's platform yet this has the possibility of severely fracturing it's fans; let me put it this way, if Bloodborne were in fact Dark Souls 3 plenty of people would be upset with From Software, because most of them started on Dark Souls and Dark Souls 2 (Demon's Souls might have been the first but it wasn't their break out game) in part due to there being multi-platform. An exclusive Dark Souls 3 directly following Dark Souls 2 would feel like a bait and switch.

 

From Software runs the risk of appearing greedy and uncaring to it's fans if a follow-up game keeping in the lore to the last two in the series were suddenly unavailable to over half of its player-base.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe if Dark Souls 3 and a new Bloodborne were releasing around the same time but the existence of the other won't do much to effect sales.

But what would a PS4 user do then? Not everyone has the money or the time to invest in two 'Souls-like' games at once. And like I said, they would be competing with each other, ultimately harming sales of both games if they were to come out around the same time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well any thing being an exclusive is a mistake in my humble opinion.

It's alright IMO as long as that franchise either stays exclusive or upon switching to multi-platform stays multi-platform. Going back to exclusive after going multi-platform is a good way to lose customer faith.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We've all ready seen it compete with itself because of Dark Souls 2 Scholar of the First Sin, and both games are selling moderately well so I fail to see where the problem is unless Dark Souls 3 somehow is turned exclusive which I highly doubt. I think there are other concerns we should worry about rather then it completing with another game from the same developer. Like the fact they will need to do something new with the story because Dark Souls and Dark Souls 2 story are the exact same thing. It was an interesting twist but if they try that again it's going to be old. They also need to work on bosses because Dark Souls 2 bosses were not all that memorably until the DLC came out.

DemonsColt likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry about the technical errors in the original post, I had little time to compose it. I didn't know that Demon's Souls was an exclusive, and this shows to me that Sony and From Software are not shy about working hand in hand, which makes the future of the Souls series even more worrisome considering two of the four 'Souls-like' games by From Software are PlayStation Exclusive.

 

But I am not concerned with the past 'Souls-like' games except in which they can help us predict what might be expected from Dark Souls 3. Like I said before, Sony has every interest in keeping 'The From Software Game' exclusive to it's platform yet this has the possibility of severely fracturing it's fans; let me put it this way, if Bloodborne were in fact Dark Souls 3 plenty of people would be upset with From Software, because most of them started on Dark Souls and Dark Souls 2 (Demon's Souls might have been the first but it wasn't their break out game) in part due to there being multi-platform. An exclusive Dark Souls 3 directly following Dark Souls 2 would feel like a bait and switch.

 

Well, Demon's Souls was an IP owned by Sony. Makes sense since Dark Souls was a spiritual successor, and in no way related to Demon's Souls. But seriously, what's the problem with Demon's Souls? That game has been on PS3 since 2009, no one said anything, and Dark Souls 1 + 2 were released to Xbox, PC, and Ps3.

 

And what are you talking about saying that Demon's Souls wasn't their break out game? That game was raved by pretty much everyone. Gave them massive exposure in North America. Heck, there's even people I know that still prefer Demon's Souls over Dark Souls.  Heck, if it wasn't for Demon's Souls, there may have not been a Dark Souls.

 

Not to mention you forgot about From Software's Armored Core series. :P

argetlam350 likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But what would a PS4 user do then? Not everyone has the money or the time to invest in two 'Souls-like' games at once. And like I said, they would be competing with each other, ultimately harming sales of both games if they were to come out around the same time.

Is there reason to believe that a single company would develop and release two similar games around the exact same time?

 

It's alright IMO as long as that franchise either stays exclusive or upon switching to multi-platform stays multi-platform. Going back to exclusive after going multi-platform is a good way to lose customer faith.

Sometimes a game can become exclusive because they had no other way to fund development and were paid by one of the companies to make it that way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, Demon's Souls was an IP owned by Sony. Makes sense since Dark Souls was a spiritual successor, and in no way related to Demon's Souls. But seriously, what's the problem with Demon's Souls? That game has been on PS3 since 2009, no one said anything, and Dark Souls 1 + 2 were released to Xbox, PC, and Ps3.

 

And what are you talking about saying that Demon's Souls wasn't their break out game? That game was raved by pretty much everyone. Gave them massive exposure in North America. Heck, there's even people I know that still prefer Demon's Souls over Dark Souls.  Heck, if it wasn't for Demon's Souls, there may have not been a Dark Souls.

 

Not to mention you forgot about From Software's Armored Core series. :P

I'll answer the questions as I see them in your post;

 

I have no issue with Demon's Souls, I own it. But most people knew about and played Dark Souls before Demon's Souls. That (Dark Souls) is the game that people think about when they think of a 'Souls-like' game. And if you want proof, here are some links detailing the sales of Demon's Souls when compared to Dark Souls. 

 

Demon's Souls http://www.vgchartz.com/game/31689/demons-souls/

Dark Souls PS3 http://www.vgchartz.com/game/47349/dark-souls/

Dark Souls 360 http://www.vgchartz.com/game/47352/dark-souls/

Dark Souls PC http://www.vgchartz.com/game/70899/dark-souls/

 

Demon's Souls total sales as of April the 4th is 177 million copies globally.

 

Dark Souls has 298 million total sales globally as of April the 4th.

 

This is why I call it the 'Souls' series break out game. Yes if there wasn't a Demon's Souls there wouldn't have been a Dark Souls, but the same logic can be applied to one of my favorite series, The Witcher. (All three games mind you.) If The Witcher 1 didn't exist then TW2 certainly wouldn't. But just like TW2, Dark Souls was more popular than it's predecessor; because it was multi-platform.

 

I'm not very knowledgeable about From Software's series besides the Souls series, forgive my ignorance, but I'm focusing on the topic at hand. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is there reason to believe that a single company would develop and release two similar games around the exact same time?

I believe you suggested a situation describing this exact event in your original post, please correct me if I'm wrong and what your original intent was. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Sometimes a game can become exclusive because they had no other way to fund development and were paid by one of the companies to make it that way.

Sure, Bayonetta 2 is a perfect example of this. But I think Bloodborne could have been made by From Software without the help of Sony; I'm certain they were actually paid to make an exclusive game for the PS4. But regardless of Bloodborne, Dark Souls 3 most likely won't need support to fund development because From Software has been making a profit with their games as far as I'm aware. I'm just worried that them being buddies with Sony and having made exclusive 'Souls-like' games in the past they won't shy away from doing the same here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Umm.. going from zero to 177 is way more 'breakout' than going from 177 to 298... demon's souls was most CERTAINLY a significant factor.. I would argue that it was 'the breakout' game. but that aside, I just want to argue you'd be a damn fool to dismiss that going from 0-177 is more significant than 177-298 when your platform variance tripled...and even if it didn't. Plus demons' souls had virtually no advertising at all... dark souls had effing heaps.

 

That's all not even the point to me personally though. I personally, as a souls fan, a 'REAL' sco.. err.. souls fan, who loved demon's souls before dark souls was even announced, AM suffering that bloodborne is on a console I do not currently own. However I do not hold that against anyone, nor do I consider it anyone's mistake...and yes I would love it to be on pc. It just is what it is...

 

My point is in the grand scheme of things, people are basically complaining that a relatively unique game they love managed to multiply, with some of it going in one direction, and another going in another. As a true gamer who loves games of every platform, genre, etc as long as the individual game doesn't suck, I see this as just an example of a great concept being spread around, and overall. I'm damn happy about the whole thing. even though I'm DYING to play bloodborne but I can't yet. If you want to prove me wrong, I suppose you have no choice but to mail me a ps4 to prove such *COUGHLastLineWasTotallyNotSuggestiveBSCOUGH*

 

edit: Bungie used to make games for macs only, not pc... then they made myth: the fallen lords (or was it myth 2: soulblighter?), which was their first cross-platform game, then they made oni, which was not only on mac and pc, but consoles too...but nobody cares about oni (though frankly it was actually a pretty damn good game, for its time, I'd say it was as good as the modern batman games...provided you consider that bungie itself kinda released it after they stopped caring about it because they agreed to make halo before oni was even half over)...

 

then came halo.I don't know if it was ever on macs at all, but it was on pc as well as xbox...but eventually, it went to an xbox exclusive, and there is no doubt, that halo is bungie's 'break-out' game... and the xbox exclusive halo games are most certainly not a 'mistake'...

 

My point is don't blame anyone, don't judge anyone. if you love a game, love the game, and if you can't play it... I know the feeling, but developers who make actually good games I respect... I respect them no matter how much it lt makes me feel left out, because I'd rather respect someone who does a good job of what I love over people who screw it up and make cash exploiting what I love.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe you suggested a situation describing this exact event in your original post, please correct me if I'm wrong and what your original intent was. 

No, my original post said it would effect sales if it happened, but for that very reason I assume that the company wouldn't work on, finish, and release two similar games around the exact same time that would compete with each other on one of the platforms.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Umm.. going from zero to 177 is way more 'breakout' than going from 177 to 298... demon's souls was most CERTAINLY a significant factor.. I would argue that it was 'the breakout' game. but that aside, I just want to argue you'd be a damn fool to dismiss that going from 0-177 is more significant than 177-298 when your platform variance tripled...and even if it didn't.

 

That's all not even the point to me personally though. I personally, as a souls fan, a 'REAL' sco.. err.. souls fan, who loved demon's souls before dark souls was even announced, AM suffering that bloodborne is on a console I do not currently own. However I do not hold that against anyone, nor do I consider it anyone's mistake...and yes I would love it to be on pc. It just is what it is...

 

My point is in the grand scheme of things, people are basically complaining that a relatively unique game they love managed to multiply, with some of it going in one direction, and another going in another. As a true gamer who loves games of every platform, genre, etc as long as the individual game doesn't suck, I see this as just an example of a great concept being spread around, and overall. I'm damn happy about the whole thing. even though I'm DYING to play bloodborne but I can't yet. If you want to prove me wrong, I suppose you have no choice but to mail me a ps4 to prove such *COUGHLastLineWasTotallyNotSuggestiveBSCOUGH*

I understand your logic, but I can't agree with it. I think we have different definitions of a 'breakout game'. To me Demon's Souls was the first 'Souls' game, introducing the concept and game mechanics to the world of what would become staples of 'Souls-like' games. I'm not trying to insult Demon's Souls, like I said I own it, but to me Demon's Souls was essentially a proof of concept; proof that a 'Souls' game has an audience in the world. Dark Souls is what made the Souls series blow up to what it is today. 

 

And while I understand your point here: "My point is in the grand scheme of things, people are basically complaining that a relatively unique game they love managed to multiply, with some of it going in one direction, and another going in another." To me it seems like an unnecessary split that has divided us into haves and have-nots. You and I don't have Bloodborne and others do. This could be a dangerous trend where sequels are bought up by companies looking to secure games for their platforms, it almost appeared to happen to Tomb Raider; Bloodborne is the spiritual successor to a multi-platform series only PS4 owners can enjoy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, my original post said it would effect sales if it happened, but for that very reason I assume that the company wouldn't work on, finish, and release two similar games around the exact same time that would compete with each other on one of the platforms.

I read back to your post and I understand the confusion here; what I was referring to is that Dark Souls 3 when released will be on the PS4 just like Bloodborne. But it is not a sequel to Bloodborne, it is entirely different so because both games stand out from each other, someone who doesn't already own either one would have to choose if they can't get both. Hence competing with each other.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

there are many other game series' that are successful that platform whore...It is annoying to be sure. My own personal favorite example of great series that shames even the most inexpensive of hookers is the Ys series. Seriously, just look at how many platforms it started releasing it games on, then look at how it jumps from one company to another, from mobile to console and back. ugh that series.. UGH.

 

as for proof of concept and 'blow up'... I think that was simply the advertisement of dark souls, not its sales count... I mean dark souls' advertisement basically was based around saying playing hard games was macho or whatever. Those are completely my words, not the advertismenet, but don't fool yourself, ever since dark souls, even though its difficulty really isn't THAT much, everyone now proclaims they like or completed so and so hard game...and battletoads...effing battletoads... I knew battletoads back as a kid. and the game was fucking shit. Nobody who played it gave a flying fuck, even the people who DID enjoy a hard game (like ninja gaiden)...but now that dark souls' advertismenet campaign makes people feel macho for claiming they like hard games... BATTLETOADS THIS, BATTLETOADS THAT...

Honestly...given that dark souls' platforms have tripled (and pc being the largest, not ps3), and that even games it wasn't even trying to advertise suddenly shoot up thru the roof after fucking 20 years for the VERY reason that was indoctrinated to souls' advertisment...dark souls' 177-298 success was mostly advertisement.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think one fact we need to get straight is that if there is a Dark Souls 3, it's not being made by the same team that worked on Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, and Bloodborne seeing how Bloodborne came out only a few months ago, but more then likely the team that worked on Dark Souls 2 so they have no ties to Sony. I doubt we'll have to worry so much on them making exclusive content. Fromsoft is not really that type of developer, along with the fact the guy behind Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, and Bloodborne is the president of the company now and likes complete games not cut and paste together in time games, I think there is little to worry about. Like I said before B-team should concern themselves with trying to make a new interesting story (Perhaps one that branches of the Scholar of the First Sin ending) and qualtiy boss designs with a better and more intricate worlds. I'd also like to point at the fact Sony went and asked Miyazaki about doing another game with them, it wasn't just Sony going and throwing money and saying go make an exclusive.

 

I read back to your post and I understand the confusion here; what I was referring to is that Dark Souls 3 when released will be on the PS4 just like Bloodborne. But it is not a sequel to Bloodborne, it is entirely different so because both games stand out from each other, someone who doesn't already own either one would have to choose if they can't get both. Hence competing with each other.

We all ready have this going on though. We have Bloodborne and Dark Souls II: Scholar of the First Sin  Both games are selling perfectly fine as is. Also for the record both games play differently. Try playing Bloodborne like the previous Souls games, you are going to die and get no where. The same goes the other way. Play a Souls game like you play Bloodborne and you are going to die and get no where. So in turn it would come down to preference on: which setting you like more, what gameplay do you prefer, and what are your friends getting for co-op/invasion. Lets also not forget that if Dark Souls 3 is actually coming (remember this is all a rumor at the moment) by the time it comes out Bloodborne would of been out for at least a year (I think I'm being generous when I say we will see Dark Souls 3 next year. I honestly would think we have to wait until 2017 for it). By then Bloodborne's price would of dropped. Now you ask what about a Bloodborne sequel.... Unlikely Hidetaka Miyazaki actually doesn't like making sequels which is why probably he hardly had a role in the process of Dark Souls 2, besides the fact he was working on Bloodborne.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Releasing on multi-platform versus one platform has it's ups and downs. For Bloodborne, it was a separate entity so no concern on  restricting your audience from a continuation (Tomb Raider, at least for however long Microsoft has the time exclusive for). It also allows the developer time to focus all their effort on single piece of tech. This gives you a better idea of what the system is capable of. You do not have to worry about down grading to save costs if you want to push to multi-platforms.

 

The downside is you limit the possibility of more players enjoying your game. If you have the game work across all platforms, you bring gamers together versus them bickering too much over which is the better version.

 

In a perfect world we would get a game that is on all three major platforms, using the very best they have to offer. Tailoring them to get the max quality we as gamers are expecting. I do not enjoy exclusive titles however software sells hardware and when you have a console like Sony or Microsoft, you need to bring your A game.

 

As some have already put forward, Sony backed From Software with Demon's Souls which spawned Dark Souls. This means we might not have had a game that generated a community who wanted to challenge their skill if it was not backed by Sony. Same could be said for Bloodborne. If Sony had not dropped the coin, we might not have heard of the game. 

 

In this rare situation, bowing to an exclusive title brought forth a resurgence in gaming. One I am happy to be apart of and very excited to see grow with new titles like Lords of the Fallen etc. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I read back to your post and I understand the confusion here; what I was referring to is that Dark Souls 3 when released will be on the PS4 just like Bloodborne. But it is not a sequel to Bloodborne, it is entirely different so because both games stand out from each other, someone who doesn't already own either one would have to choose if they can't get both. Hence competing with each other.

No offense but, I think by the time Dark Souls 3 is properly released and sold in the market Bloodborne would've aged beautifully. I mean, let's face it, by this time all PS4 owners who wanted to play Bloodborne should already have Bloodborne and for those who don't it's more likely that they don't care about it. Add this to the fact that all games depreciate so even if that time comes and someone has to choose, Bloodborne's price would've dropped to a point that you can buy it alongside with another game. My point is there's no need to conceive these dilemmas.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now