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Athlex

Elder Scrolls Lore

23 posts in this topic

I was thinking of putting up a thread to discuss the Elder Scrolls lore, since it's so massive and diverse.

Feel free to make questions and/or discuss.

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I don't know anything about lore, but I will be following this thread closely.

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I've always been intrigued by Dwemer culture. It's strange how they mysteriously disappeared. Does anyone have any theories on how/when/why they disappeared? I feel that it might be a good topic to discuss.

derrk and MountainMan096 like this

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Ok, this question is answered in-game i believe, don't remember which book atm but whatever i'll answer it here. During the "first era" the "Atmorans" (they were believed to be the precursors to the Nord race i believe, don't quote me on that though), with Ysgramor as their leader tried to conquer/colonize Skyrim. Another race which was native to Skyrim the "Snow Elves" went into hiding in the mountains and they took refuge with the Dwemer, in exchange for them eating some sort of toxic fungus which eventually blinded them. Eventually the Dwemer forced back Ysgramor and the people with him (don't believe it says anywhere how many was with him) and only let Ysgramor himself and his 2 sons live. Anywho after this had happened the Dwemer enslaved the Snow Elf who had sought refuge with them. However a few decades after this event the Snow Elves turned into the Falmer, and the Falmer eventually fought back. This event is called "War of the Crag" and it ends with the Dwemer vanishing. This is why you primarily see Falmer in Dwemer dungeons and why they're blind. 

 

Btw feel free to ask more questions, i have read every single in-game book and heard pretty much all the dialogue, there might be some stuff im rusty on. (If you ask about lore when it comes to Morrowind for example) That being said i'll try to answer everything as best as i can.

Bananaking likes this

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MonocleViking. Another theory is that the during the construction of the Colossus. (GIGANTUAN DWARVERN CENTURION)here is a video based on lore. Its great. Skip to about the 10 min mark to learn about the possible disappearance of the dwemer.

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"I've always been intrigued by Dwemer culture. It's strange how they mysteriously disappeared. Does anyone have any theories on how/when/why they disappeared? I feel that it might be a good topic to discuss."

 

It's left purposely unresolved in the TES series, but according to Morrowind lore it occurred during the apex of the War of the First Council between the Dwemer and Great House Dagoth and the other Great Houses lead by Lord Indoril Nerevar. This war was sparked by the revelation of the intended usage of Keening and Sunder by Kagrenac upon Lorkhan's Heart, something which the Dunmer saw as profane. While the exact events that transpired at Red Mountain remain uncertain (was Nerevar killed by his loyal Councillors? Or died by his wounds from Dagoth Ur? Was there any Dwemer there at the time of the assault on red mountain? or had they already disappeared? etc), It is made clear that Kagrenac attempted to manipulate the heart during the War of the First Council, and that the Dwemer disappeared during the war's apex in the Second Battle of Red Mountain (Red Mountain being were Kagrenac was located).

 

Drawing from this, it's generally assumed (though not conclusively resolved, and there are competing theories), that the attempted usage of the tools by Kagrenac upon Lorkhan's Heart was probably the cause of the disappearance, the reason for that occurring as well as the Dwemer's ultimate fate is a lot more inconclusive.

 

if another lore buff wants to correct me on something, go ahead, this topic is pretty convoluted by far.

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So what I got from this is that the Dwemer vanished gradually in time, since they were the most spread out people in all of Tamriel. Because they also had settlements in Skyrim, and all the rest of the provinces, BUT did they vanish all at once? It would be nice for Bethesda to let us explore this in the next single player game. The Dwemer were known to perfect themselves, to the point they challenge the gods. Maybe they developed a way to travel into time (Related or not to an Elder Scroll) , or just simply a mass teleport to a far away place. Would be interesting to see that in TES VI.

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So what I got from this is that the Dwemer vanished gradually in time, since they were the most spread out people in all of Tamriel. Because they also had settlements in Skyrim, and all the rest of the provinces, BUT did they vanish all at once? It would be nice for Bethesda to let us explore this in the next single player game. The Dwemer were known to perfect themselves, to the point they challenge the gods. Maybe they developed a way to travel into time (Related or not to an Elder Scroll) , or just simply a mass teleport to a far away place. Would be interesting to see that in TES VI.

I don't think it was a gradual decline. Firstly it's seen in lore sources that the the Falmer arose one day for combat against the Dwemer, only to not find them and to discover that their halls were empty. That, and the fact that they disappeared suddenly also during the War of the First Council makes this seem more of a global event, and one that was sudden enough to surprise the very races that they were in constant conflict with (the Dunmer and the Falmer). The only (known) Dwemer to avoid the catastrophe is Yagrum Bargarn, who did so only by (if I remember correctly) not being in the same dimension at the time. Despite his hardest efforts over centuries, he still is unable to discover what ultimately occurred to them, which also leads me to believe that it isn't as simple as them simply dying out over a long period of time.

 

The idea that they willingly, as an entire race, was willing to and undertook time travel doesn't really make any sense, especially considering they left pretty much all of their most priceless artifacts (Kagrenac's Tools, The Heart of Lorkhan etc.), time travel itself is a bit of an iffy concept in TES, no indication that they planned for anything like that and there isn't much of a motivation to do so. Teleportation to a far away place again would make no sense for the same reasons.

 

It'll be interesting to see what Bethesda intends to do with the fate of the Dwemer, though any conclusive revelation about them will probably never match up to the mystique brought about by their unexplained and abrupt disappearance.

 

My view is that Kagrenac, by attempting to maipulate the Heart of Lorkhan, inadvertenly caused his whole race to disappear.

Athlex likes this

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Gentlemens Hello.

 

If you wanna know something about Elder Scrools lore then I suggest getting on this youtube channel made by ShoddyCast

http://www.youtube.com/user/ShoddyCast

He makes videos where he explains everything about the elderscrool lore in a story telling kinda way. He is really good.

 

Best Wishes

Mr. Davidson

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In my opinion the Heart of Lorkhan was definitely involved. If you want to believe to Baladas Demnevanni the fact that the dwemer people disappeared during the first council war was just a coincidence, hard to believe for me. What i can't remember is if they actually managed to create Anumidium or not.

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The Dwemer were trying to 'ascend' using the Heart of Lorkhan, if I remember correctly. Perhaps, Kagrenac manipulated the heart as planned, but when he did, the whole race 'ascended' and simply disappeared. Its been awhile since I've thought/read about it, so my lore is kind of rusty. I'm pretty sure they were trying to gain immortality with the heart though? Anyway, that is my theory. My very rusty theory.

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Or maybe that plan backfired and they just simply disappeared.

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Interesting question: What do you think is happening in Morrowind at the time Skyrim takes place. Sure, we know a little bit, but I would like to know more about the Red Mountain eruption and what followed. I mean, we know what caused it, but doesn't anyone want to head back to Morrowind so we can see for ourselves? 

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(My favorite thread of all time ever.)

How many Dunmer does it take to change a lantern?

 

All of them. One to change the lantern and the rest to die in a volcano eruption.

MountainMan096 likes this

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Interesting question: What do you think is happening in Morrowind at the time Skyrim takes place. Sure, we know a little bit, but I would like to know more about the Red Mountain eruption and what followed. I mean, we know what caused it, but doesn't anyone want to head back to Morrowind so we can see for ourselves? 

Well, as you know in Skyrim, they fled westwards through Skyrim, and most of them settled there, specially in Windhelm, as you may know they live in the Gray Quarters.

Another thing I know is that they built a shrine to Azura nearby Windhelm as well.

Pretty much all I know about the outcome.

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What I love about lore in TES is that it's all a grey area. Historical bias are purposefully included in books to add more realism to the whole thing. Further still there are many interpretations on many of the same events- especially when the name Lorkhan is brought up. Elven culture sees him as a trickster who managed to convince their ancestors to give up their immortality and thus curse them to be mortals. Humans on the otherhand see him as a creator who gave life to Nirn and the 9 divines sacrificed themselves willingly to help in the creation. More still are the beast folk who have their own ideas about what happened and why.

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If anyone wants to add any lore to this topic, feel free. Let's make this thread like a "library" of sorts.

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Interesting question: What do you think is happening in Morrowind at the time Skyrim takes place. Sure, we know a little bit, but I would like to know more about the Red Mountain eruption and what followed. I mean, we know what caused it, but doesn't anyone want to head back to Morrowind so we can see for ourselves? 

A part of Morrowind is under argonian control, the rest probably is divided between the Redoran and every other house wich replaced the Hlaalu.

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From what I have read about the lore of the Dwemer, the heart of lorkhan is what made the race dissapear

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Kinda my own interpretation of ES lore.... the city of Vivec. Most people say it's built in a cross shape, but if you really look at its shape, it really doesn't make as much sense. My theory is that Vivec was built by the Dunmer as an external example of the internal/spiritual state of Nirn.

morrowind20090803140638.jpg

Using Tribunal knowledge, I believe that the Palace of Vivec is the "holiest" place in Vivec. Using that idea, look at the layout of Vivec. The farthest away is the foreign quarters, a place for outlanders and foreigners who probably do not believe in the Tribunal and just want to be there for commerce, or are curious about the tribunal religion. Going farther inward, you have the Great Houses, not the most spiritual by any means, but more than those filthy outlanders. Especially interesting is where the houses are placed, with the Redoran Canton closest to the temple and the other two houses, Hlaalu and Telvanni, on the outskirts and a little below Redoran, possibly showing their worldliness or selfishness in comparison to that of House Redoran (not saying that House Redoran is perfect, but they have the best relations to the Tribunal temple). Going more inward you have the saints' cantons, which obviously relate the the holiness of St. Olms and St. Delyn. Finally the grand maze of Vivec narrows into one corridor at the end with the Temple being the most holy place for any mortal on Nirn in Vivec and then the Palace of Vivec himself, the Holy of Holies if you will and reserved for the god Vivec.  

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What do you guys think about the fact that Talos/Tiber Septim is nowhere to be seen in Sovngarde. We know that warriors and heroes that have proven their mettle and died in battle will feast for eternity in the Hall of Valour, and since Tiber Septim not only became the first emperor of all of Tamriel but also were uplifed to godhood and proclaimed the hero-god of man after his death, I whould say that he accomplished quite a lot during he's life. Dispite that he is nowhere to be seen in the Hall of Valour. Could this imply that he actually became a god, and that the Thalmor are dead wrong and the humans were right all the time. What do you think?

 

The thought crossed my mind when I read his wiki page on the TES wiki. Its pointed out in the Trivia section of the page.

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