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Sargefan19

Is it just me or has gaming changed?

44 posts in this topic

I know everybody is entitled to their opinions and can like whatever they want and that is cool because everybody has their own identity, but has anybody noticed how the gaming industry has changed over the years?  I think it stated last gen when publishers tried to figure out what they can and can not get away with dlc wise. I remember back in the day when map packs were given out free and you didn't really have to pay for diffrent modes unless they typically added whole new mechanics to the game. I know Joe pointed it out with Metro Last Light where they were charging 5 dollars if you didn't preorder to get Ranger mode which was advertised as "The way the game was meant to be played" and it was already on the disk or part of the download in order to play the game which I found also to be something unacceptable. There has been a trend with this though in which you will have skins or characters on the disc or Day 1 dlc and the person who bought it has to pay for it. I know Destiny has been found out to do it recently and I know for a fact Gears of War 3 did it with the weapon skins plus there are probably tons of other examples I can't recall at the moment. I easily see the game industry easily making this a common practice and some people seem to be openly accepting of it while trying to proclaim the people who are trying to take a stand as "people just trying to find a reason to hate" . So what are your takes on on disc or day 1 dlc, should it be accepted or should it be something that the gamers need to stand up and tell the publishers that it is not wanted?

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Unfortunately people use to make games to make an awesome game, today they make games to make money. Now I don't have a PROBLEM with making money, but when you are making a product using the formula minimize overhead while maximizing profits, you end up in the situation we are in today.

ProfessorOaked likes this

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I remember back in the day when there was no dlc and the game came with everything. But to be fair PC games did have expansion packs and not all of those were good either.

 

 

 

Unfortunately people use to make games to make an awesome game, today they make games to make money. Now I don't have a PROBLEM with making money, but when you are making a product using the formula minimize overhead while maximizing profits, you end up in the situation we are in today.

Don't kid yourself, games were always made to make money.

Puntosmx likes this

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I remember back in the day when there was no dlc and the game came with everything. But to be fair PC games did have expansion packs and not all of those were good either.

 

 

 

Don't kid yourself, games were always made to make money.

Well yeah your right. I meant it more in the way that they wanted you to get what you paid for.

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So what are your takes on on disc or day 1 dlc, should it be accepted or should it be something that the gamers need to stand up and tell the publishers that it is not wanted?

 

gaming has changed, for the worse. gaming was better 5-10 years ago, much better. games usually came in full, didn't have dlc slapped on afterwards for more money, and i feel more care went into storytelling and plotlines.

 

note: ive edited this because raging is stupid and i dont want to be stupid.

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I know in general games are made to make money but it is the way they are trying to make money now that worries me. Picture you go to a car dealership and go buy a car, you drive off the lot turn on the radio that is in the car and it tells you that you have to pay 60 dollars to listen to the radio that is in the car you bought. If that were to happen people would be pissed I just can't understand that people can accept and defend this practice with gaming.

fridgeracer likes this

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If you dislike DLC whoring just don't buy it. It's not like you're missing a lot of stuff. I just buy new campaigns, actual expansions or other things that interest me and I'm quite happy with how it works in general, most times I won't buy overpriced DLC until it's a seasonal sale.



My signature videos illustrate that gaming as a whole has probably never been better and used to be much worse if not at least the same it is now with different tools... I knew that would come in handy someday again soon.









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You are right, gaming did change...a lot.

 

Today some games are sold into pieces, the storylines are cut into DLCs, most games are short, have shitty microtransitions and this and that. I don't think gaming has changed to terrible, but it definitely changed in many ways. Some good and some bad. Many companies realized how they can suck out money easily from people and people blindly do it. This things aren't going to change until gamers also change. If we keep on feeding the companies, they will bring out these kind of games all the time. 

 

When it comes to singleplayer games, I want them like before...give me a game with great gameplay and storyline and the graphics...let them be. I don't need extreme graphics,  I need extremely good gameplay. Crysis is kind of a perfect example for me for a FPS game. It's probably the most unique FPS game imo, it had amazing graphics, great features, great storyline, amazing gameplay and amazing maps. I want such singleplayer games, such FPS to come out more often. Something innovative, not copy pasted crap we get all the time, it's the reason I completely stopped playing FPS games and I grew up playing FPS games. Last FPS game I played was BF3 which is simply Battlefield, I'm fan of the series, I plan to buy BF4 too because of the multiplayer, but it's singleplayer is horrible...and so is any other FPS game today. RPGs and open world/sandbox games are the only games I stick playing to today, only games I get some fun with...otherwise I skip everything else, nothing impresses me anymore. My last hopes are Fallout 4, Dragon Age Inqusition and Witcher 3...I just hope these 3 games don't disappoint. 

In Bethesda, Bioware and CDKPROJEKT I trust. ;P

DemonsColt and ProfessorOaked like this

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Gaming came from humble origins and has since become a profiteering industry with little regard for the consumer.

It was an industry based around innovation, originality, and creating unique and feature rich experiences to please the consumer market with the hope of also turning a profit.

This has changed dramatically over the years and the focus has shifted. It's no longer like that, it's about the money first and everything else comes after.

Avatar was the highest grossing movie in history, was it also the best? Not by a long shot. That is what gaming has become, what mainstream concept will generate the highest profits based upon hype and surface appeal, Resident Evil 6 is a gleaming example of this.

How can we make the most money, put in the least effort and charge even further for what should be included content. That is gaming now, and like the OP stated this trend began in the last console generation around 2008.

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To me a good game should not rely on graphics, good story and gameplay are what count. Right now stuff seems to be putting flashy graphics over story which is sad.

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To me a good game should not rely on graphics, good story and gameplay are what count.  Right now stuff seems to be putting flashy graphics over story which is sad.

To be fair this has been true since the days of old with the NES, Turbo Grafx 16, SNES, and Megadrive.  Sega does what Nintendont amirite?  The console wars of yesteryear make the present day console war seem like a food fight.  That said, I agree that gaming has become overly reliant on graphics, DLC, and aggressive marketing, but it always has been really.  The real changes have probably come from increased consumer awareness, micro-transactions, and DLC.  When DLC is handled right then it is pretty awesome, but handled poorly and it is just.......the worst.  I lack words to justify micro-transactions......they just kinda suck all around........

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The thing is back in the day I never felt like most games were holding my hand and walking me along every step of the way like i do nowadays. Also I feel like story tended to be focused on more than nowadays. Last gen seemed to be the gen of bland color pallet shooters where you get told to go to places and you either have to shoot aliens or terrorist/russians as well as had to wait for textures to load because everyones rendering engine had to load them in.

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I've only found everything to have gotten better. To think otherwise I would have to be going out of my way to avoid all the great games we get now and to be completely oblivious to all the bad that happened in the 80s and 90s.

 

To me a good game should not rely on graphics, good story and gameplay are what count. Right now stuff seems to be putting flashy graphics over story which is sad.

Like when publishers/developers constantly ignored or canceled 2D games when the Playstation and N64 came out because everything had to be in 3D.

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(...) I think it stated last gen when publishers tried to figure out what they can and can not get away with dlc wise. (...)

Yes, gaming has changed as the years pass by.

But I wanted to highlight this part of your post, because it's a critical component of WHY the games became like it.

In the sixth console generation, only the Xbox had internal HDD.

For the seventh gen, all consoles had internal drives, and both the 360 and PS3 were programmed to install the games before playing.

This allowed for the convenience of patching games, which enabled publishers to launch DLC and expansions into the consoles.

This is what changed the gaming world, for previous games were played "as is", and patching bugs could only be done by releasing a new batch of fixed games.

So, in years gone by, if a company wanted to release a secret "ultra-hard" mode, it had to be included in the disk/cartridge and it would require some sort of achievement to unlock.

Currently, it's possible to develop the new game mod days, months or years after release and charge for it as DLC.

Of course, it went south (did it cross the Bravo river?) when companies started to lock content in the disk behind a paywall, but that depends more on ethics and policies of said companies, and less on the technical capabilities of the consoles themselves.

Recoveryanonymous likes this

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I think the naysayers are just focusing on the bad dissapointments and are just overlooking the huge array of good games, which is a shame. However one beautiful change is how the industry now enables single people or small low-budget teams to make some quality stuff. Back in the days that was virtually impossible to do, you needed some money to distribute/publicize/manufacture copies of your game, and god forbid making it on a console, where you'd have to pay a few limbs to liscence it for a console. I think the playstation 1 was really the first console that didn't try to rape their devs in that way, not saying that as a fanboy but just saying nintendo and sega weren't really all that friendly in that regard back then.

Puntosmx likes this

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In the sixth console generation, only the Xbox had internal HDD.

For the seventh gen, all consoles had internal drives, and both the 360 and PS3 were programmed to install the games before playing.

This allowed for the convenience of patching games, which enabled publishers to launch DLC and expansions into the consoles.

This is what changed the gaming world, for previous games were played "as is", and patching bugs could only be done by releasing a new batch of fixed games.

So, in years gone by, if a company wanted to release a secret "ultra-hard" mode, it had to be included in the disk/cartridge and it would require some sort of achievement to unlock.

Currently, it's possible to develop the new game mod days, months or years after release and charge for it as DLC.

 

But pcs have been able to patch for years before the consoles and you didn't see that type of trend with them. Also i do admit their are good games nowadays i never denied that.

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yeah I was more addressing people with the "good old days" mindset moreso than your own, and I know they aren't alone, a LOT of people think that way.

It's important to recognize that super big name games are pretty mainstream these days, and even if they aren't targeting a female-oriented audience like the sims, candy crush, or whatever, they still aren't really for nerdy-ass gamers like games did back in the 16 bit days or whatever. They try to appeal more to the mass demographics of people who in the 16 bit days wouldn't dream of playing video games because they were too nerdy, but had nothing against watching TV a few hours a day. That's the kind of "average" gamer now IMO (if you omit the super casual gamer oriented games). I think people should try and develop a feeling for identifying those games and avoiding them if they so wish, and they will see there are still plenty of nerdy gamer oriented games to choose from.

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But pcs have been able to patch for years before the consoles and you didn't see that type of trend with them. Also i do admit their are good games nowadays i never denied that.

No, but PC gaming hasn't been a mainstream thing until a couple console generations ago.

In the mainstream, games were played in arcades and consoles, and PCs were for working on.

But as the consoles have slowly become more simmilar to PCs in the hardware, so PCs have become better adapted to gaming on.

PC gaming grew up with an inherent patchability, moddability and expansionability, and PC games included such avdantages into their development cycles. It's just become a problem when these "niche benefits" became mainstream in most gaming platforms that the big companies found the way to make more money out from them.

I'll be repeating myself from a simmilarly-themed thread: "_____ was fucked up when it hit mainstream" In this case, the blank is DLC.

fridgeracer likes this

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Gaming is a lot better now. There has always been shady business practices. Difference is now we have the internet. We know more and companies get away with less. 

Puntosmx and Gone too like this

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No, but PC gaming hasn't been a mainstream thing until a couple console generations ago.

In the mainstream, games were played in arcades and consoles, and PCs were for working on.

But as the consoles have slowly become more simmilar to PCs in the hardware, so PCs have become better adapted to gaming on.

PC gaming grew up with an inherent patchability, moddability and expansionability, and PC games included such avdantages into their development cycles. It's just become a problem when these "niche benefits" became mainstream in most gaming platforms that the big companies found the way to make more money out from them.

I'll be repeating myself from a simmilarly-themed thread: "_____ was fucked up when it hit mainstream" In this case, the blank is DLC.

That's largely a "PC gaming is dead" era myth, PC gaming was quite mainstream* with games like Counter Strike, Quake, Starcraft, Warcraft, Command & Conquer, Civilization raking in just as much if not more than their console counterparts, some of gaming history's most praised titles were PC exclusives like Deus Ex, Diablo, Baldur's Gate, Fallout and so on. In fact other than the fighting game community, professional gaming has always been based on the PC.

*Well gaming wasn't mainstream but PC gaming was quite signifcant.

Sargefan19 and Apex Spartan like this

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PC gaming back when Counter Strike, Quake and Starcraft was popular was so amazing. I remember as a kid, I didn't have a PC and I would go to those PC stores where you paid to play for an hour, 2 hours, 3 hours and so on. Sometimes I would just go there and watch the older guys from the neighborhood play those games against each other...it was amazing. So many good memories...those games were kings, in all ways.

 

Have games changed from then till now? Like I said yeah, but as technology increased, as internet spread out more, companies took advantage of that. Before we couldn't get updates or DLCs, games came out and if there were bugs, you had to live with it. Today we can get them fixed. Yea, Battlefield 4 needed 1 year to get fixed with 1000 updates, but not all games are like that. We get DLC's and expansion packs which is great, but what is not great is how some companies sell them. Some DLCs are worth the money and some aren't. I think such issues will just stay depending on the company. Some companies will make free DLCs and others will sell them for appropriate prices and some will be asswipes and sell them for a full price almost. 

The only thing I hate now is the Kickstarter and early access games. Not because the games are bad, but the business model. How many of these games were cancelled and people pledged money on them? How many of those games won't see the light of day? Not to mention, so many are coming out now that a big part of those games are horrible...many people see how they can grab money, so they plan to make a game, they put out the plans, they put a trailer and then the game is either cancelled or is horrible. The problem is not in the games and it's not in the business model, it's in the developers of these games. Many aren't well committed, many are new and think, "Ok let's kickstart a game that changes everything" and then they gather money and after many months, they either don't know how to make the game, they get lazy or end up in some trouble and cancel the game. What about all that money that everyone pledged? Oh right, it's gone. 

I'm not saying, some games funded by kickstarter are awesome, but don't deny that a huge part of them is a big fail and that a huge number of indie developers failed to fulfill what they promised. The difference between indie developers and major developers is, major developers either finish the game or if they don't, it's their loss, you don't put your own money for their game. If they cancel the game, they burn themselves, not you.

This is the only thing that worries me today, that spread out really fast, it's the kickstarter and early access games. So many games in early access that won't get finished or that are not the way they were promised. Don't get me wrong, I don't hate Kickstarter or early access games, but I'm saying it's risky and it's spreading out like cancer...it's kind of like betting on a soccer match or a tennis match. You put money on it and you hope to get your game, but there is a chance you won't.

We just need more committed indie developers who will finish their games and less "wanna be a game designer" who never finish their games, but they take all your money, that's all. That's all we need, more committed developers. We have them, but point is we also have many who aren't.

 

As last, modern gaming today is great, it has it's downsides just like 90s gaming did, but it has it's great sides. Business models have changed, games have changed and a lot has changed, some to worst and some to better. You just need to live with it and live with the change. In next 10 years, gaming is either going to get 20x better or it might get 20x worst so enjoy it now while you can.

2014 itself was not a great year for gaming for me personally, I haven't found that many games to enjoy, but 2015 is a whole different story...we got great games on the way so look at it on the bright side.

Puntosmx likes this

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The thing is there is always that PC gaming is dead thing is not true. Remember when they announced how many number of games were played of Halo 2 near the time Halo 3 came out and people were like "So you mean it has had less games played than the number of servers for Counter Strike Source". Pc gaming will never die the thing is devs and publishers want to try to act as though they are second class cititzens for no reason. Also i would argue with Pc you have fanbases stick with games longer. Look at CSS and DoDS both have been out since i was in the 10th grade yet i can easily go and find active servers and there are tons of older games like that. The thing is with retail you see a drop in pc sales because most pc gamers have moved to digital means of obtaining games years ago with steam a process which we are currently seeing consoles try to copy. If Microsoft or Sony ever get to the point where they have like a 1 tb hard drive in their consoles (tech has to get better to make it cheaper though) then alot of people will never go to a store to get their games again because they already have the marketplace going for it that is decent.

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People who say PC gaming is dead probably live in caves. PC gaming will never die, it just won't. It's like saying...damn, I just realized I suck at coming up with comparisons so put simply, PC gaming will never die. Unless someone comes up with a device that has greater capabilities than a PC and it simply replaces PCs, that's all, but I don't think such a thing will ever exist...I just can't think of anything to replace PC.

 

Who ever came up with the idea that PC gaming is dying? Wth...

Sargefan19 likes this

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^
Hit the nail on the head

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That's largely a "PC gaming is dead" era myth, PC gaming was quite mainstream* with games like Counter Strike, Quake, Starcraft, Warcraft, Command & Conquer, Civilization (...)

*Well gaming wasn't mainstream but PC gaming was quite signifcant.

You got my point, maybe I just wasn't able to convey it adequately.

Gaming has been a subculture for... ever? It just tends to come into the limelight when a scandal surfaces (like right now).

And still, most of the attention in gaming turns to consoles, probably due to the cyclic nature of consoles and the companies that make and sell them.

So, PC gaming has been a subculture of gaming.... even if it has been growing yearly since... Prince of Persia, more or less.

That's why I consider that pc gaming was "not mainstream", for it receives little attention and publicity, in comparison with gaming in general and with social attention and news in a broader vision.

I mean....... how many commercials does nVidia places on TV, compared to XBox?

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